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hi I'm Hampton okay and i'm here to talk to you about the future of SAS how many
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people here use SAS hi nice to meet you
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all yeah so I created SAS for something
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years ago for five years ago I kind of did the initial stuff hope and more of that and so I decided it's been I think
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it's been four years since I talked at a railsconf and like so this is I feel
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really good being back like I'm back with my people you know like finally a crowd I understand and so I kind of want
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to start off with just a real quick like where I've been just like a quick little update because I love talking about me
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and I know you love hearing about me so this was something that Ryan Carson said to me he's like used to do all this cool
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stuff before then you disappeared and I realized I kind of stopped talking about what I was doing like I stopped blogging
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and I was just doing stuff but I didn't actually tell anyone so yeah I was like
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that's what I'm doing the section cuz I'm like I want rails people I want you guys to know what's been up and the
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simple first answer is burnout I worked at a consultancy called n space in Toronto which despite what ehh keep
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saying I'm not Canadian I wish I was me no I'm an American but i was living in
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canada so whatever yes ass was invented in Canada but it was written for like a
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boutique consultants he called on space and you know we did really great work I was really proud of what we did there I
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worked super hard but what kind of happened was these people keep coming in
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with you know they come with an okay idea like people too much money and there's like hey should do this whole web thing we'd come
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and take the idea and I put my heart into it I'd make it into something I was really proud of them like this is awesome like no you're going to make so
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much money doing this just do this in this and cover the whole plan and build it and like spend three or four months of my life on it and then inevitably
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what kept happening besides only two clients I think they just kind of they failed at it like they kind of gave up
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or didn't actually go through with it or only kept it up for a couple of months and didn't go you know talk or get any
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groups or do any marketing or even blog or any the basic things that we would
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just assume you do and it's amazing how fast that can kill something like even something that's kind of good just nobody ever goes to the site you don't
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tell anyone about it you know I try to tweet but that'd be it so yeah I just you know I couldn't do it couldn't do it
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like I was like I have to make something myself and I think that's a very common thing you hear the people who do consulting at the end you're just like
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okay it's my turn to see if I can do this so a friend asked me like I just
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overheard them go I actually didn't even have an iphone and they were like I wish I could like view Wikipedia on my iPhone
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so I made this I I pedia or I wick depending on its version this is like
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what i did is i kind of like stopped being part of the rails world and you
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know it had ads on the top and it's it sold really well as the first wikipedia
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up out there you know it's not perfect but I was pretty proud of it got really
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popular crap ton of downloads I don't know the exact number but it is the unit of crap tons the problem was that this
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was called I wick the Wikipedia encyclopedia a little problem the W is
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copyright and you can't really say wiki plus encyclopedia without start to do some trademark infringement so I got a
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call from Mike Godwin who's the legal counsel for the commedia foundation that
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runs wikipedia and of Godwin's law by the way casing he was familiar with that yeah but he called me up and just like
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hey you know this isn't cool but would you mind changing it and these are the things I was like yeah I'll change it
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but uh like do you guys want a nap so as
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it turns out i think i'm the only software like only start over in there was acquired by wikimedia i
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totally think I get the only they actually kind of bought it and bought me yeah and I don't definitely don't think
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that's happened before or since so this it kind of I got even more W's in the corner I was like yeah or official now I
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mean this wouldn't do a bunch of virgins I assume you guys have seen I'm not responsible the most recent one it's not
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getting great feedback the one right before was the the one I built it's true
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go look in the store sort of look done nobody i love those guys they're working really hard in their fantastic after i
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installed them publicly but the real thing i was doing why was there there was the app but then there was the
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mobile site and that was really the heart of what i was doing so if anybody
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has drunkenly looked up a fact on their iphone and seen the mobile site yeah that was team of one doing that so I
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kind of disappeared but I showed up while you were drunkest it's a bit like being the Hampton ferry floating in and you know you didn't even know I was
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there there were two sets of tracks in the sand I was one at whatever many how
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so still being offensive it was written in verb and yeah it just recently it's
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still the same product to get ported about six months ago to PHP don't ask
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but 1.8 billion monthly pageviews so I'm pretty proud of that yeah I think when
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it switched for movies about 900 and it wasn't for performance reasons it was political which sucks but also I did
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this sorry I'm go faster if this dictionary I don't know if this one of the things I'm most proud of if you
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don't have this app get it it's free but what's on different platforms with the iphone one like it was with the iphone
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3gs and i wanted to have an on phone dictionary so and had to fit in i think it was ten megabytes of the time and
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also had a terrible processor and sequel light with indexes I couldn't really use so it but its search as you type and
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with sound alike algorithm so you can misspelled words and it will figure it out for you which was super ridiculously hard i spend like a month just tweaking
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the algorithm so the user experience was awesome you can see the same user experience now on your iphone 4s but the processor is
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crazy fast and so all that hard work would have just been easy now many also whole bunch of people that did some more
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stuff gap with white cats called color puzzle and then I kind of got bored of
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just doing my own stuff and basically now I met move web I'm the director of
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engineering there and kind of oversee our platform development basically we kind of take regular websites and make a
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mobile and we try to do in a way that doesn't suck as the I think the woman to
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present early this morning on all the bad sites none of those are like ours we do too can we do good ones we're kind of
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still if though they shown our technology maybe we'll be hearing about this later some other point but yeah
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we're about half a billion page views through our cluster and yeah went from oh sorry the important part not funded
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completely bootstrapped two years ago for people today 43 and we're profitable so yeah it's pretty awesome we've been
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growing like crazy I know right it's like it feels so good to say that it's like yeah we didn't take a dime it's all
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yeah but hiring is a little stressful because you're like do we really need this person but you come out of
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something good all right back to the SAS at hand another great joke I think so um since kind of at that point I broke off
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from working on SAS or Hammel and you guys probably know these fellows Nathan and Chris who like the amount of Awesome
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I can say about them I just can't like they have really run the project they've owned the project they've made it what
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it is today if I had been running it it probably would have ended up like less
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or something not not very well polished that's my insulting thing to less no but
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like they they really brought all these extra features kind of when I left it was like all I wanted was nesting and variables and like maybe some functions
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and mix-ins like the most basic probably the way I think a lot of people use it or like me but they really gone and the
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thing is just deep you know you can go pull into it as a language and there's all this craziness and then I want to
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clear up a couple things about SAS real quick scss this is may be contentious with people it's the extension de SAS
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files now that's the way we're timing indented sasses will remain supported
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but the brand confusion on what's SCSS what's ass scss is really taken off
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people really like it new users you know as much as i'm like hey just learn it you know they really connect with it and
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so you know even a move web we as SCSS I know Chris uses SCSS so we're kind of
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going with that so now it's really just the extension to SAS files isn't of fact the book pragmatic guide to SAS by
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Michael Caitlin and Hampton Caitlin available now for purchase we only talked about like we don't really cover
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indented SAS which was the thing I made for myself but other people you know they kind of put throws people off so
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anyhow that's just said to settle that and it's a snot SAS please don't do this
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it looks like you're screaming it's a backronym not an acronym okay I just thought SAS was a funny sounding name so
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i went with that and everybody now just when i see that it's like yeah I don't
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know it looks like something made by a committee when it's all on letters or something right yeah so what am I
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talking about now is SAS 3.2 and SAS 3.2 has been all Chris and Nathan's work i'm
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not claiming i helped with any of this but i'm simply tell you about it yeah so
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this is actually going to release a long time in coming it polishes off a lot of corners and it should be out in the next
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couple weeks where you go through a couple of things that are coming into SAS in the future police holder
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selectors so this there's been a lot of
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requests with wait who here uses at extends okay yeah so it's it's
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definitely a ninja tool and this kind of gives you a little insight into it it's
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really really awesome it's really worth looking into Chris when he usually does his talks it's all about these kind of
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features and i'll be honest i mean i use this a little bit but i don't write that
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much sass anymore i mean i'm not doing a lot of front-end work I'm mostly just coming into other people's code but this
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stuff's really really powerful but basically when you define a class you can kind of use that class later and say that it
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really inherits from those selectors so it's kind of like I think of it like mix-ins but you're also bring along the
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selectors and one of the problems is like let's say you want to make a reusable class that you're going to
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extend somewhere else well it would always print out like the normal thing is it would print out that selector that
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you never actually used on your page so by putting in sorry so the proposal have been at silent you could do at silent
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put a selector and it would never print out so instead if you put a percent in
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your selector that will that first bit will never actually print out itself but what you've just done is you declared a
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placeholder selector and later anywhere else in your file you can use it so
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libraries and stuff can define these so here I take dot highlight and I extend with a strong link and then all of a
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sudden see how it kind of places itself into that spot the logic to get that
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done and it extends is mind-blowing because you're really there's a lot of math about selectors and it'll do even
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crazy stuff like this is a simple example you could just put it in place but sometimes when there's a comma and
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you're doing multiple selectors or conditional selectors and it all kind of works which is pretty awesome so that's
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the thing that's going in this is 1 i'm really excited about mixing content I also call it blocks for mix-ins which
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will make sense to Ruby people so here's the example and this actually your I would totally will use this as soon as
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this is out mix an iphone that i have a media query inside that mix in and then
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I kind of define some stuff and then I say at content and that's basically the yield right so it's saying right here
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put anything you passed me so then when i use out include iphone down below this is where i'm actually going to print
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stuff out and then i say body color red so i passed in those selector sorry
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those attributes into the mix in which we have never been possible before you just call them and that's it and then
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look what happens I media only screen and then kind of nested inside that is this body so and going further where
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this gets really useful is we now support what I call at media craziness I'm sure
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a lot of people here have hit this add media is not perfectly taken care of and SAS 3.1 and before it kind of like you
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can do simple ones but it you can't combine them they can only I think they can only be on the route like there's
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all sorts of not goodness about it we kind of like basically this is a huge push almost every you can nest at media
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queries and it will join them with an end you can use you could call at iphone
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somewhere deep in your code and it will just kind of go back to the top level in place at media's around it so it's
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really nice this will really help with responsive design stuff this is a feature I like load paths it's pretty
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simple seems like it should have been there before variously they're also called include paths but you can
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actually set an environment variable and say hey add this kind of using the colon normally unix style you say hey this
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folder search here also for spss file so if you have like a little snippet or like a little repository of your secret
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tricks and stuff and you're compiling locally you can do that so it's kind of cool and this is what compass is going
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to use in the future because you just it's a load path instead of a special case and then some deprecation 'he's 187
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is now the minimum ruby version but if you're using 186 that's the look i gave
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you I am person foo is gone I don't know everything is a really cool thing it
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used to be what we kind of do to get around not having out extends when you want to do some kind of ninja put these
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two together in a different way but you now you have to have a space and that's
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because doing the ampersand got really confusing in the edge cases like do you actually insert the previous selector in
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there anyhow blah blah blah it doesn't work that way anymore it's only the simple case use ad extends that's much
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cleaner way it's got all the proper logic behind it it will behave in a repeatable and understandable way thanks
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for watching oh I was trolling you we
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actually are announcing something alright so coupling just to start some
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pros and cons of SAS first alternatives number 1 mature like way older than any
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other ones and with that bug fixes and edge cases or pretty much taken care of it you don't really deal with them these
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are all the good things advanced you can do like I was saying that extends although there's very few situations
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were like no that's impossible Chris I've seen make sure that you like he's the most advanced user ever and like
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he's thought through all of this so there's an answer maybe some of our competitors have lots of we don't handle
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that as a response and so that's things like full unit support and if you can if
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anybody gives suggestions on how to do the units will take them if we can make it work better we have tons of functions
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selector inheritance which is the same as that extends I mean in tons more once again see Chris Epstein talk he will
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brief you in all of it but here's the downsides accessibility yes Ruby is
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installed on a stock Mac but getting a designer to go into the command line and
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type that stuff and it's kind of a big step for them also if your designer you used to working with a framework we do
00:16:40.649
have the gooeys but those are kind of also you have to go kind of setup stuff on the side and a lot of people are kind
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of not into that you like you have to go if your designer uses you have to go to the developer who's you know using
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whatever technology to a to go doing this is this is where less really one when they went to JavaScript right drop
00:16:59.910
it in the page you don't need anything if you got a browser you can compile so they really kicked ass with that and
00:17:05.970
then speed speeds a pretty big issue if you're a really advanced user wait i
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hope we here's a good question who here thinks speeds an issue in SAS whose to that point okay alright so the rest of
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you have pretty small projects because it move web between art we have ton of projects but I about fifty thousand
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lines of sass I think caring calm or chris's have probably has that on there one ref site so the average project that
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we have is about 30 seconds to compile caching helps with this stuff if you have it set up right but if you push too
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coo or whatever in your asset pipelines a little off then it takes this or longer some of our projects take about
00:17:42.780
two minutes to compile which is just unacceptable like completely so that's
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why I'm proud to announce SAS jayus no
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I'm trolling you I'm totally trolling you hell no they're already got that they already got that I'm sick yeah no
00:18:00.720
we're not doing that noise it's even crazier than that so how can we get it
00:18:06.870
fast and accessible what's the language that you can compile anywhere Lib SAS
00:18:14.299
like we re implemented SAS in c yeah it
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was crazy it's mostly this guy Aaron yeah I mean if I hadn't met Aaron who is
00:18:25.470
just super de Solis Marty works in move web loves parsers loves languages and when when I kind of mentioned this idea
00:18:31.830
which I think only if you've ever read the SAS code and you know the edge cases that are covered in there I mean it is
00:18:37.770
complex there's there's like lists that aren't keywords which are also arrays I
00:18:43.650
need to be dealt with in like the same way is it's crazy right but he really took on the challenge and well hopefully
00:18:51.000
you guys will think we did a good job so here's the main design constraints that we had so it's a see interface with C++
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internals we're corrupt quite crazy enough to build a full tree and see we try to get this done in about two months
00:19:05.330
so yeah c++ internals its statically linkable and also no external libraries
00:19:12.450
that that would've made a lot less it would have been a lot easier we should like imports nice tree algorithms or
00:19:17.850
something or an ast or something like that nope statically linkable its small ish the main site it's about 600 k if
00:19:25.980
it's a library compiled on my Mac mostly you actually have to keep a list of all
00:19:31.980
the colors I don't even think people notice you guys know that you can add red and blue together and then sass will
00:19:37.289
compile out to fuchsia like it actually figures it out and then if you use a color that's a hex code it'll look up
00:19:43.049
the word so that takes some size because we have the full list of all the colors
00:19:48.419
plus some extras want to have a simple interface so it's really easy to integrate and obviously
00:19:53.830
fast and then for now we're doing sass 3.1 features not the ones okay 13.2
00:20:00.280
thick it is just a set of goal right it's not out yet but we're like okay if we can get this done it'll be awesome
00:20:06.990
the development was sponsored by move web mostly because I said we use it internally a lot and a lot of our tools
00:20:14.560
are now using go so we actually wanted to on our production servers not have to have Ruby installed but you know we just
00:20:22.150
like why isn't as possible also right we should be able do this you guys for about two minutes less than Chevy
00:20:28.330
grayling she's a little over two months in we actually got a lot more done than I thought a lot more edge cases are
00:20:33.460
covered and then the big thing is working on adapters and I'll get into that in a minute so here's the stuff
00:20:39.430
that is pretty much completely covered mix-ins just work anyway use mix-ins variables are good most unit conversions
00:20:46.450
that's more I'm scared that there's crazy units we missed that's all I'm trying to read through the code on that
00:20:52.180
but you know simple interpolation there's some edge cases that don't work
00:20:57.300
most functions color functions if anybody loves color math please help and
00:21:04.930
then honestly it's every besides the color functions it's everything i use personally is currently working so when
00:21:10.450
I just go start writing it just it does what I do there's stuff that it doesn't do yet where selector inheritance is
00:21:17.680
coming probably in that this is a release I'm going to do next monday so Aaron right now as I'm doing this is
00:21:24.010
currently coding on making sure that this works correctly full interpretation with all units and then hopefully we'll
00:21:30.160
have gone through and just double-check sure we have all the units it's all the normal units but I don't know you guys
00:21:35.440
me you can do crazy unit math and conversions and stuff and so don't know people do it but you probably don't even
00:21:40.630
notice when you're using a library right you're mixin can use certain settings and then it doesn't matter what you pass
00:21:47.080
in any oh and then after that obviously color functions control directives and
00:21:53.440
then a callback api call that kpi is pretty big because you can implement functions in Ruby right now basically we
00:22:00.280
want to MIT we want any host environment to be able to mimic that where you can actually go into whatever language you're using and just
00:22:05.919
go right a you know in that language go write a callback function I'm sorry call
00:22:11.080
a function in sask will eventually get routed to that language there's the
00:22:17.649
benchmarks I had trouble making it clear but there is a green line to the right of it yeah and now it's pretty fast it's
00:22:28.419
roughly this is the worst case number this is out of our projects we've been compiling this is the worst case number
00:22:34.029
of speed improvement yeah so and the
00:22:39.369
best case when we do one big file and it's super nested a lot of this is IO kind of limited both languages are
00:22:44.649
having to wait for operating system to read a file right so lots of files lots of i/o but it's about 10,000 times
00:22:51.789
faster not % not times whoo ten thousand percent faster if you do like one big
00:22:59.499
file or iOS and really the thing it's more calculations and stuff all right so
00:23:04.599
lips s is is kind of inert itself it's built in the tradition of a proper library like you can compile it but it's
00:23:12.820
just a library file he doesn't do anything so sassy it's a good name right
00:23:18.549
sassy yeah yeah I like it so in generally sometimes well find myself we
00:23:25.029
refer to the overall project is sassy but like really strictly there's they're two different things so lib SAS is
00:23:31.059
basically the internals when you build sassy sassy is an executable project and
00:23:36.339
we don't it's not perfect yet we're quickly trying to add like we would work
00:23:41.739
in the library so much that only the last two days where we like oh we should probably write the wrappers now so it kind of works in this forum where
00:23:48.999
you kind of run it and pass in a file name and then it'll pipe out the results but we're gonna you know it's just you
00:23:55.299
have to go in to see and just write the stupid code right but you can pipe in you can do all the normal stuff we can do with the command line SAS and this is
00:24:02.469
how we ran the test by the way we so it was actually starting up a process and Ruby we didn't require to do that so it
00:24:08.979
was a little bit of cheap well cheat and that it helped Ruby but yeah this is the way we ran the test but the real plan
00:24:15.399
for this thing is this Ruby which is a real project that I've been working on wraps around lips ass it
00:24:23.510
uses Ruby ffi rate compiler looks just like nokogiri you install it says compiling and then you're done so it's I
00:24:31.730
didn't upload to the gym server yet because it works on my computer but I know these native gems I didn't want to
00:24:36.799
look like a fool if everybody's like holy doesn't install so give me a couple days on that will be tweeting
00:24:42.380
that but the repos there and yeah so we're just wrapping lips asteroid loops
00:24:47.659
ass is just the guts it's just the logic but I really want sash Python it's ask jas I mean I'm not gonna probably work
00:24:54.350
on the I don't know about those languages I don't really want to know about them necessarily it sounded really catty didn't it yeah but like I want
00:25:01.669
people to go build this I mean we can do with J&I I don't know people in Eclipse land like why can't they enjoy what we
00:25:07.880
have right like that's that's what I really want I want it to be that it's just part of your normal tool chain so I mean there's more sass whatever language
00:25:14.600
I don't care Oh sasco is another one I'm i mean i'll be releasing that one soon I'm just cue really quick about the capi
00:25:22.370
I know it's really simple oh and I think that's what I'm trying to prove that even if you don't really know see that
00:25:28.130
well you'll be like oh that makes sense so this is basically how that red doesn't work does it this is kind of a
00:25:36.970
mangled version of what sassy does but all you've to do is build a context
00:25:42.890
object called SAS new context you have it it's a struct you sent input string
00:25:48.350
on it then you can set the output style and then you run compile and then the
00:25:53.390
context object has errors and it also has normal other stuff that you'd be looking at this would break in an air
00:25:59.570
case I think you just print out nothing but this would print out the output and then you it's see so you need to free
00:26:06.260
the context that's that is the API it's very very dumb and we wanted it to be
00:26:12.529
dumb because you know integration should be easy and then just really quickly
00:26:18.409
these are the strokes wow I'm going fast I know you guys have some questions SAS
00:26:28.370
options that's like a shared object right now we only have two things and it but include pass is important you
00:26:34.520
probably put the director you're in even wherever your SAS files are plus compass and load path and all that and then this
00:26:41.120
is you see SAS options as part of this context and this context is particularly for strings so we do input string output
00:26:47.360
string air status and error messages it's pretty simple we have two other context you don't have to pay that much
00:26:53.660
attention but I mean there's a file one where you just pass it a file name and plus mostly the same options the other
00:26:59.210
ones a folder which is the way that kind of rails works for you you know subfolders we want to see it's actually search path instead of input path so we
00:27:06.770
go find all the files compile them keep them all in memory at once so that we're not having to like you know we can just
00:27:12.050
focus on the output files a little more efficient but you know you can you can do it all with strings if you're writing adapter library we don't really care you
00:27:18.230
can handle it we don't really it's fast know if we don't care yeah and look the
00:27:23.780
question is why right like is it like oh let's get out of Ruby forever no it's
00:27:29.990
not this is about like I truly believe SAS is awesome like I've made a lot of things in my life right you know like
00:27:37.280
well go hamel I still love hamill i use hamill i'll never stop using hamill I built it for myself you know and I'm
00:27:44.840
happy other people like it people come up to me and they're like what you know why I you know him I really camel and
00:27:51.770
I'm like good I mean I don't know I I do I mean and it's fine I mean I don't it
00:27:57.980
doesn't hurt my feelings you know people seem guilty about this I wouldn't really use Hamlin like yeah I don't yeah and it's not a big deal because honestly it
00:28:06.410
was something for me and sass started that way but it's become something different like when IC designers and
00:28:11.600
people using CSS and then they like the dumb the stupid thing you can nest like
00:28:17.450
do like what Oh obviously you should have right like I'm still surprised I
00:28:22.910
can't as far as I can tell anywhere on the Internet this was the first time buddy thought to nest CSS really or at
00:28:29.750
least they ever even proposed it I nobody's even pointed out a thing like that like that's such a dumb obvious
00:28:35.540
idea and like you know less is doing their thing and they're kind of going for the node crowd or what right but like I'm thinking about all
00:28:42.540
the people in corporate offices doing design right and they're having to work in a built environment they didn't choose and they don't even like right
00:28:48.990
why can't we bring that to them you know SAS came out of the joy that I got doing
00:28:54.030
rails you know that that freedom that as you learn you become like a ninja right you don't feel strapped down by the
00:28:59.730
environment you you learn a new thing you can do and you just refactored your coat it's more beautiful right that's
00:29:04.800
that's that power that's I mean at least that's why I'm here and that's why i love rails and and I think SAS has some
00:29:11.100
of that but less for me because I don't spend all day doing CSS but when IC designers who work for me and they're
00:29:16.380
you know personally ought to learn something like no no this is the trick with scss this is why it was so successful it's like no no you can just
00:29:22.980
keep doing everything you normally do don't change anything try putting a variable in and they're just like what
00:29:28.830
like and it worked magically so i really i really want to bring this out to people i really want to bring this to
00:29:34.650
the world I'm kind of and part of it is the competitor I'm gonna keep that
00:29:40.350
competitors I don't really feel like there's a lot of edge cases they miss and I mean stylist and less and a whole
00:29:46.260
bunch of other ones that are out there that are just popular you know they're either really flimsy or they kind of
00:29:52.080
look just like the number of open issues on lasts like and the response to most of them are just like oh like oh sorry
00:29:59.490
yeah it doesn't do that it's supposed to be small right but like why can't we bring a really powerful full-featured
00:30:05.010
environment to designers with every like full out software development why can't
00:30:10.590
design be that right and that's the mission I'm on and that's how much I know that's I think I think that's
00:30:15.810
Chris's on his blog it's like he's like making web design like or have all the
00:30:21.150
same tools of software development right just make it a real thing you empower them and people are happy they make some
00:30:26.370
love their job again so what can you do obviously you guys are rubios so SAS
00:30:33.810
Ruby try to install it give me feedback for breaks Felgate issues please if
00:30:39.990
anybody here know C++ or used to do it and wants to help out with color functions really appreciate it
00:30:46.700
evangelize I mean that's and that's why follow me on twitter @ h Catlin and
00:30:51.740
retweet which sounds stupid but when I I'm a little worried like when we come out with like SAS Python right like
00:30:58.830
most people who follow me or rubios and they're like her Python okay or whatever
00:31:04.170
you know it's the other guys we're not usually retweeting Python stuff all the time but like if if people do that then
00:31:11.130
they'll hear about it you know if you just take that one step somebody follows you probably does it right so then
00:31:16.590
they'll get to find out about this cool thing that came out of the Ruby community so yeah that's and you know
00:31:22.320
tell your designers if you're at a company and that first or the I don't want to learn something new and be like you don't have to it's okay calm down
00:31:28.520
you know it works with CSS CSS is totally valid and yeah so here's the
00:31:35.880
link gasm I think these are all live Michael yes all right so they just went
00:31:43.470
live so there's lib SAS which is the internal library there's sassy which is the binary which I'm trying to get brew
00:31:50.130
going for that so that you can just do brew install sassy I mean like come on that'll be so awesome right and then SAS
00:31:57.210
Ruby which I really want to get going because think of it like ER beavers rubus right I mean obviously rails will
00:32:02.850
never include this because it compiles but you know and maybe your things that's a little one why not have it
00:32:07.980
right why not give back to the Ruby community with this there's my twitter at age going so I never pimpin enough
00:32:15.960
people are always like oh you kind of mumble over your twitter name and so I'm trying to do it a lot and then yeah so
00:32:23.940
the pragmatic guide to sass which I by the way is a dream to write for prague
00:32:29.429
prague like you know just such great authors they're such great people in getting to work with them was amazing
00:32:36.030
like total lifetime dream and i got to write the book and my husband Michael and yeah so we have a twenty five
00:32:42.540
percent discount code makes a great stocking stuffer for Memorial Day is that coming up yeah I don't know give it
00:32:50.220
to you give it to designer friends it has easy install instructions you know or what I do it like sometimes just like
00:32:55.830
you put on the coffee table at work you know people like Oh what anyhow so it's
00:33:02.700
30 minutes past now so I think obviously we have some time for some QA
00:33:08.029
please don't beat me up about Hamill I don't care if you don't like it but any other question ya know you actually can
00:33:15.590
I will if somebody wants to discuss it questions oh yes lady back there
00:33:38.740
he I know right I'm glad you like camel so
00:33:50.070
the question was a besides Hamels awesome the question was what was the
00:33:57.240
like what toolchains do the designers and move web views uh I mean without
00:34:02.550
getting into too many specifics we have our own so I mean that's kind of what we're doing it is a platform i think i
00:34:08.880
can say that much so it's kind of tightly integrated into it so yeah i
00:34:15.030
mean that is kinda one of the downsides right now is that if you're not doing rail if it's not rails project it's easy
00:34:21.060
drop it in this folder it builds you don't have to think right but yeah I mean and this is actually one of the
00:34:26.730
reasons behind this is there like their Scout app which can compile stuff for you if you don't like the command line
00:34:31.770
but yeah I mean there aren't a lot of tools that integrate and you know yeah
00:34:37.470
like I was saying you know Ruby's installed on Macs and that does make that easy so that's good but you know
00:34:42.630
windows things what about commercial applications you know I mean I my life will be changed the moment that a
00:34:49.500
commercial application comes out like whatever dreamweaver or something right and there's just save as a CSS like that
00:34:56.490
would just write and Cohen Ruby like Rudy people we this is our thing and it's in your world now that's what I
00:35:03.360
want and so that's I mean it's exactly it's like oh you play with that oh that was cool but it doesn't work in whatever
00:35:08.850
I mean I'm curious what to without you giving anything like what tools that do
00:35:14.040
you guys or did they primarily use
00:35:31.770
so you but you mean like text editor an IDE kind of thing so we use a sublime and textmate I think are the two mmm
00:35:44.880
yeah I mean well vim has highlighting eMac says highlighting text mate and
00:35:50.340
then everything that supports textmate does yeah so what we're mostly using text pane sublime think of the two most
00:35:56.940
popular them if you want to show off is nicely Lucy the way it works in the office it's true no I'm sorry not did I
00:36:04.170
just totally insulted ever even person here including you I'm sorry it yeah
00:36:10.620
yeah yeah yeah no because it does look cool right it's like I never left still
00:36:17.790
the terminal I think it's kind of cool i'm like i can like do the simple
00:36:23.460
commands like WQ editor file and i feel cool enough doing that and then I see like pains and i don't know if i get a
00:36:30.660
pain if one appears on them I've done something terribly wrong I need to quit right now I'm like whoa I don't know
00:36:36.930
what I just did yeah vim or as i like to call it oops i forgot to hit i I don't
00:36:43.110
know if anybody else has a dance yes sorry uh other questions doctor
00:36:58.119
hmm so it's going to be I I mean my plan is that it is so SAS is going to remain
00:37:06.980
especially with rails SAS gem the normal SAS gem is going to remain as it is and
00:37:12.859
it will continue to probably be the place where most language changes come in so that will continue so it's like ER
00:37:20.539
B&E rubus right and especially because rails has a rule which makes sense no compile gyms or by default because you
00:37:27.859
don't want have to have a whole build environment just to install it um so I think the gym is going to be called
00:37:34.250
sassy just cuz i do just like the name right the project's a series that dumb
00:37:40.010
that's dumb I don't know seems don't know Jim SAS Ruby you're in Ruby you're
00:37:45.109
like I know it's Ruby the important part is the sea part yeah so they'll both
00:37:51.010
continue so I mean personally in my rails applications i mean it you know
00:37:56.450
i'm going to start putting this in as a like personal i'm compiling anyway so you know and I want to make stuff little
00:38:04.509
yeah that was the first name of it and then it was I you guys want to hear all
00:38:09.950
the details of that process on this no yeah so that was my first version and then I was like lips ash Ruby then like
00:38:15.170
it's not so but the thing is I want like SAS Python SAS Jas and so I'm like I
00:38:20.420
can't say that that naming convention that I want to see in other languages we don't do in Ruby so I was like it was
00:38:27.170
either SAS Ruby or SAS RB but shied you look at Twitter poll decisions by
00:38:33.559
committee and group think that's the best decisions ever yeah so I don't wait
00:38:39.470
which one do you like yeah the fourth
00:38:44.809
out so you have a slow oh sorry I should really be repeating what he likes a four thousand percent the recording this this
00:38:50.960
is a one-sided conversation with an Australian so yeah you like the four
00:38:57.230
thousand percent yeah me too is there a Windows gym hopefully i mean
00:39:03.849
i'm using rate compile which is supposed to do cross compiling i did a lot of the work on the flight without internet so i
00:39:10.300
was just reading source code trying to figure out how it worked and i'm not a build expert so it was I'm just glad I
00:39:17.320
got it building on my machine but I'm sure there are people experts in here
00:39:22.420
who one little patch would solve that but yeah I would love it to run on windows with with SAS Ruby I mean that's
00:39:27.839
there's no reason it can't compile and windows maybe we haven't there might be some way we haven't done it but we're
00:39:34.900
not using any extra libraries were only using the most base CSS C++ and C library I mean bears standard libraries
00:39:41.530
just the most standard all right anybody else no I thought there were more hands
00:39:49.000
they reach I'll son there we go no no
00:39:58.240
indented I'm sorry I know and that was the that was my idea I mean I still like
00:40:03.700
it I'm not it's it's in a way the
00:40:08.859
struggle for me is I I like indented a lot I think it looks really clean and it was actually funny Michael when I writing the book he's like we should do
00:40:15.099
this indented I think it looks better and he's not a breeze not it wasn't a program he learned all of this to write the book oh I just yeah dropped out of
00:40:22.630
his biology PhD and then like prag prog asked if we want to write the book and then yeah we were like I was like I
00:40:31.329
don't have the time to do it he's like I'll do it I was like yeah all right I'll help ya Sonia so I think a lot of
00:40:38.920
people who don't do CSS I do think it's easier to understand like traditional
00:40:43.990
sass i do but i think the real realization for me is that like
00:40:50.680
sometimes it's not about it's not I mostly go off what I like is what I'm
00:40:56.200
going to go with but I think this is one where I just have to go you know if every CSS person out there I want them
00:41:01.839
to have a just no friction moment coming in like you don't if your developer
00:41:07.720
turns on on SAS you can you can just keep writing CSS you didn't get you
00:41:13.599
don't feel that you have to learn something new and so it's it's only about the human element on this and the
00:41:20.150
kind of that moment that we can give however I am pushing and I don't know if
00:41:26.750
I'm Nathan area disagree on I really the plus syntax for mix-ins and equal
00:41:34.640
probably I really really want brought into CSS because the ad includes and all
00:41:40.460
that the original one of the original ideas with SCSS was kind of okay if we make this thing awesome the w3c might go
00:41:47.000
that you did it exactly that was so it's actually kind of designed to please what
00:41:54.349
they might do so it's like oh they would like at rules because that's what they do so we should have at rules and that's
00:42:00.800
there's a fair point it's also more similar to CSS but I just yeah so in
00:42:06.950
case you know you can do add includes for mixin but then in SAS traditional SAS it's just plus the name so it looks
00:42:13.550
nice to me because it almost looks like you're kind of a pending you know you're just like oh add some selectors hear
00:42:19.280
this you know and that I think it just looks so clean and I hate type II I that include and I just bugs me we'll see
00:42:26.960
maybe libs supports that secretly I didn't I didn't say that yeah anything
00:42:34.970
else what time do I have oh we have a couple probably time for one or two more
00:42:40.309
questions if there's anybody actually with questions or if I'm just oh wait in the back sitting yeah you better yell
00:42:47.890
just scream aah
00:43:09.790
hmm if you want to dig in the lib SAS yes I mean that isn't in the sea
00:43:15.880
interface right now but I mean there is if you look at the sea driver file it
00:43:21.070
basically just kind of pull pushes away all the error handling and stuff so that
00:43:26.500
is all kind of clean and but yeah you could if you want integrated with the
00:43:32.020
c++ stuff that'd be the way to do it at current to get it done it doesn't have a
00:43:37.630
full AST tree all the time the output it kind of is half streaming which i think
00:43:43.960
we're going to be changing but the whole point is it that can change and then the capi that most adapters will use it
00:43:50.920
doesn't really matter right it's the same as far as you can tell whatever happens inside is what happens inside but no I mean yeah passing and data
00:43:57.190
alright sorry I keep forgetting to repeat the question I'm looking at you camera so what if you wanted to pass in
00:44:02.440
a data structure into SAS instead of read on a file and yes you're welcome to
00:44:08.850
brave the internals yeah all right one more come on somebody's got one more
00:44:14.590
question for me and then don't just make up something right there I'm very
00:44:23.290
serious with a discount code and it is misspelled I know it has all caps is that the yeah so that came from the
00:44:29.770
editor she sent that to us and I didn't notice it till I put it on there and then I was like yeah it's all caps
00:44:37.030
on that but that is incorrect yeah railsconf catlin test 2012 I should
00:44:43.600
probably tweet that she didn't say not to anyhow all right that's a great question because that's available at
00:44:49.570
pragmatic programmers com or Amazon but the code doesn't work at amazon so go to Prague Prague they're awesome and the
00:44:57.070
book is amazing it's for beginners that by the way so sorry there is some advanced stuff covered but it's pretty much for beginners okay wait one more
00:45:02.830
question yes oh yeah sorry I probably show me to that a little bit so
00:45:09.040
basically as far as when they see something monolithic and external they're out they're not interested I
00:45:14.440
mean it was like it's like talking to deaf people about it there don't even want to look but Chris has been working
00:45:20.620
really hard I mean my god that guy is a trooper being on the forums of the w3c uses for
00:45:26.440
these proposals just answering questions and debating with people and just so there is a proposal I meant to have the
00:45:33.010
link for it that is I think accepted ish for CSS three or four whichever I don't
00:45:39.730
know where it's going to fall but for nesting so nesting is going into CSS which I just like to think that I made
00:45:47.319
that happen all by myself but yeah it's good so the first thing I really wanted is is in so yeah if they done that
00:45:54.549
earlier I wouldn't have had to do all this work anyhow so that's a discount code I'm Hampton feel free to come talk
00:46:01.359
to me of course move web is hiring and I do have cards because that's what we do yeah surbhi have a great day thanks for
00:46:08.020
coming
00:46:23.460
you
00:46:57.810
member